Saline Preservation Association

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Hi Desert Warrior

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Posts: 209
 #1 
On my trip to the springs, two weeks ago, I noticed that the vaults were pumped.  Must have been done before the last storm a couple of weeks past.
paul belanger

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Posts: 270
 #2 
ewwwww, LOL

Yup yup yup....if you do want to burn the poop with the paper, don't freakin' pee in there also.  The desert can take care of the pee just fine.  And fast, too.
VegasNaturist

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Posts: 40
 #3 
Those "burn it" suggestions reminds me of a funny story...

Back when I was active duty, I was assigned to a Forward Air Control Post. This meant we performed our mission out in the field. On one such mission, we had a rather green First Sergeant. He was told by those who will remain nameless that the proper way to dispose of the porta-potty (yes, that's what we used) contents was to burn it. So, he gathered a detail together, and proceeded to dump the porta-potties into an empty 55 gallon drum. He poured some fuel on it, and ignited it. After a while, he not only realized he'd been had, but he also had a nice, piping hot pot of "cream of sh-poop soup"...

John
paul belanger

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Posts: 270
 #4 

Let me reiterate WHY I am interested in this subject, as the initial posts are way back in another thread:  It's obvious the pumping of the vaults is one of the biggest $$$ concerns the NPS has. 

Why now after 15 years?  I have heard the NPS has their own rigs, that I am sure they don't want to shred prematurely.  I have personally seen a smaller rig (with a chase truck) pumping the vaults, not sure if he was a federal employee or private contractor.  And there is a anecdote on here that a private contractor quit after making one run.  It seems that whatever they were doing isn't working anymore.  IF we could help somehow to not overflow the toilets, it could make good PR during the scoping process.  Besides not causing the vaults to get locked.

If there was a new proliferation of persons digging holes on the outskirts of the camp areas and filling them with poop/paper, that might just give additional fuel to the "close the springs" mentality we are all afraid of.

Personally, we have always had a 5 gallon bucket with a toilet seat and a cover that we use at the campsite, then dump the contents in the vault, and burn the plastic bag that held the contents.  (I never would throw the plastic bag in the vault with the contents.)  The wife and I started that tradition because we have little kids with us and they can't make it in the night walking to the vaults.  A low-tech cassette toilet of sorts.

But, OMG, I have never thought to, or wanted to, take the contents out on the Saline road with us.  All that shaking could cause the contents to escape.  I hope that is not on the horizon.

florida

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Posts: 294
 #5 
A great deal of the volume of waste in the vaults is paper. A covered can next to the toilet seat, similar to what is provided for tampax and pads in conventional bathrooms, could be used to reduce the waste. Line it with burnable bags, burn it when full. If someone finds that objectionable that person could still drop their paper into the pit. This would stretch the time between pumpings considerably.  We could try this out for only the cost of a suitable can and some bags.
Personal porta-pottis are also a good idea. But I would hate to see the vault toilets locked because an awful lot of people will just go poop on the edge of camp.


VegasNaturist

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Posts: 40
 #6 
Just my $.02. We often camp in the backcountry around Lake Mead and Mohave with the boat. We have always been of the opinion that we pack it in, pack it out. As such we always bring a porta-potty and even have a "shower" tent we take to put it in. When we get home, I just dump it in the sewer cleanout on the side of the house. It's really no big deal. It's shit, not toxic waste afterall (well, having kids and grandkids I sometimes wondered though). I have no issue with taking the potty out when we visit the springs.

Just sayin...

John
Ed_B

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Posts: 49
 #7 
Not at all tronaborn . However, it is a two way street. That is why I have never been sarcastic towards you or most others.
tronaborn

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Posts: 92
 #8 
Ed, 

Respectful discussion of things that matter to us all is what's supposed to happen here.  You seem to have missed the "respectful" part.  Anyone that takes the time to post here obviously cares about the springs and deserves something more than sarcasm and insults.
Ed_B

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Posts: 49
 #9 
LOL.......
Hi Desert Warrior

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Posts: 209
 #10 
Here's an idea.  NPS could put coin boxes on the vaults to off set the cost of dumping.  Or better yet pad lock the vaults and have everyone bring their own portapotty.  For those who can't or won't, I can visualize venders setting up portapotties and charge for pooping, like $5.00 a squat.  On certain days it could be big business and bring in the big bucks. 
paul belanger

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Posts: 270
 #11 

Ed.....well no shit, amigo.  Of course I am "directing the nature of board discourse" here.  Last I checked this is a "discussion" board.

I was interested in discussing the vault toilets.  I was asked to take the conversation concerning feces and toilet paper from the "Camp Needs" section, to a more appropriate thread, which I politely did.  It turns out, persons had asked the same questions I had asked 2 years previously, so I simply revived a thread from October, 2010.

The "nature" of my discourse that you don't like..... is I that am somewhat civil and discuss issues without constantly going off point on name calling rants against anyone who disagrees with me.  YOU followed me here to continue to heckle me.  What is it I am saying that you so object to?   

I got your views.  The vault toilets were a bad idea in the first place.  NO ONE thinks the feds are anything but myopic.  I AGREE.  But should we, or should we not, do anything pragmatic about the overflowing that we have all seen?  You have stated you are unwilling to touch feces or it's paperwork.  Then what are you advocating?  Can you state a coherent opinion that might help "direct the nature of the discourse" in a way that you prefer?  First you rant and rave against the feds, but then you seem to be demanding that they get their asses out there and pump the vaults as often as you need them to.  Is that your position?

Can you provide a non-epithet laden response?

James Sel

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Posts: 379
 #12 
Paul you have my vote!....not that you are be something you not . But your posts seem level minded and just down right thought out. 
Ed_B

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Posts: 49
 #13 
Interesting how the self anointed ""BOARD MONITOR" directs the nature of board discourse. No.  I do not insult intelligent and independent posters here;  just government brown nosers.  But, in deference to at least topical "peace" I will make a concerted effort to avoid responding to Paul's posts.  "peace.".....
paul belanger

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Posts: 270
 #14 

Red Jeep --
I wasn't meaning to infer that assisting with the pumping of the toilets would change their plans per se.  Just a way of letting them know we have always shown stewardship of the place...and have historical rights therefore.

As for red tape, you're right, to a point.  I am a non-union contractor in West LA.  We have worked at Santa Monica College.  It can be done.  Need worker's comp and liability certificates, and , most important, the money used to pay for services must not be from tax money.  (Bacon-Davis legislates that only persons receiving prevailing (union) rates can perform federally funded tasks.)  Some government agencies are happy to receive help, as long as the money used is not co-mingled in any way, it must be raised from private sources.  The beef might come from the unions.

This being said, I agree that likely no private contractor wants it, due to equipment failure.  Why trash your income producing investments (trucks)?

My main point here is if the Saliners accept that the overflowing could be mitigated, we might be heading on the right track.  The NPS has the equipment to pump, they just don't want to do it very often, due to expense.  If they had to do it half as often, due to awareness on the part of the users, they might appreciate the help.  Courtesy can go a long way. 

ltlredjeep

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Posts: 26
 #15 
Paul.....
I think your heart is in the right place, but pumping the vaults will not have any affect of the DVNPS putting their plan for the Springs enforce.  The Springs are part of DVNP and as such, the NPS has control and the pumping of the vaults is their responsibility.  The hiring of a private contractor to pump their vaults would need to come from the DVNPS, not any individual or group.  Any time you contract with any governmental agency and need to enter one of their facilities, there is always the "Red Tape"  i.e. contract, workers comp, liability insurance and the like. That said, donations to the DVNPS for that purpose might be excepted, that again would be up to the DVNPS. 
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