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Salt Peter

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 #16 
Wow what a long winded paragraph.

So let me get this straight. At first you have all the time in the world and now you don't have the time.

All this chat cost the springs money? Did you have an extensive donation and trip plan done and ready to implement?

So by your numbers you are in your 40s. You're almost over the hill yourself so better pony up to the "old" club. Kinda insulting but ok. You're young and able to help out and anything is appreciated. I'm glad I learned to clean the tubs and do if it hasn't been done already during my visits. The older guys usually beat me to it.

I would love to see all your photos of things that need to be addressed. Since you're old friends with Lee did you discuss these things with him? He is the camp host after all and can provide help and insight about how to get things done.

I sincerely doubt 45 gallons of bleach was laying around leaking. You busted your ass in the heat when you were there cleaning it up? When were you there in the heat? Most recent reports are that there is no more bleach. Did you pour it all out during the summer? If there were others around did you ask if they could help you?

Your desire to clean up the clutter is impressive. Can you take any with you next time in your FJ? Just do one quick trip in with nothing in the rig and you can get rid of the debris and clutter. Just make sure it is truly clutter and not something Lee might use or need.  Your comment about infrastructure is interesting. You do know the park has to approve of any improvements right? Of course you know that since you've been going there so long.

After reading your linkdin, your job history, education, and posts here I think you are self serving snake oil salesperson. Get your story straight and stick to it. You have contradicted yourself when called out. Since you sell insurance you know how much you would have to carry in order to perform this tourism venture from Vegas you have planned. Then you want to make it a "charity" and donate much of this gold mine to the springs. Death Valley has had a strong history of those proposing interests in gold mines. Leadfield comes to mind.

I can't claim to have been coming to the springs from times of old when it was first created, nor before it was included in the national park system. I can say in the years I have been coming to Saline it has changed me. It is a wonderful place, cared for by good people. Now while these people may not see eye to eye about how it is managed I'm certain most would say a tourist transit business to the springs is not a good idea. The road in can be a challenge and for good reason. Come and enjoy the springs and do what you can while you are there, join the board on SPA and learn about the threats to the area and how to help protect it. If you are only in it for yourself then keep that to yourself.
Terawanderer

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 #17 
Hi Elle..
 Thanks for answering my questions......However the question of what Lee thinks of your idea was answered with "He knows me and my family"....That is nice....  .....So specifically answer what does he think of you bringing a lot of European tourists to the springs.  Thanks in advance...... 
4runnerbutt

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 #18 
  #1 
Now that I live close to my favorite place in the world and I own one of the best desert vehicles ever made, I'm chomping at the bit to be more involved with the springs. For starters I'm now offering Saline Valley Shuttle Services from Las Vegas NV and Big Pine CA. It's just me and my FJ Cruiser, so no more then 2 people, and no more then 2 trips per week. Contact me for arrangements and quotes. Please spread the word to fellow Hotspring nudists who would love to experience SV Hot Springs but don't have the proper vehicle for the roads. Some Equipment rental is also available, ice chests with sun protection/cooling system, and water jugs. Cheers 🍻 . Each visit I can update the forum with road conditions, bring in supplies, help with repairs and maintaining the springs. I can be reached at 503-728-8239. I'm planning on a solo trip soon, if anyone in the area wants to join me let me know...cheers, Elle

Attached Images
Click image for larger version - Name: IMG_5173.JPG, Views: 58, Size: 708.90 KB  Looked kinda ready to me[wink]

MagoElle

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 #19 
I've heard enough. I just moved, have my hands full putting things together, no time for this, so this pipe dream of mine is going on the back burner. Besides all this wasted chat just cost the springs more money. That being said yes yes yes I was planning on giving my clients a detailed desert camping education as well as outfitting most of the equipment. The cost to this service is very high and high end, Sorry but I won't be traveling for hours in a little SUV with douchbags that would trash the springs, people like that drive me mad, and people like that don't tend to invest is desert experiences. I was most likely going to camp along with the party, that way I can be by the springs. Last time I was out there the old springs community is just that, getting older, and slower, relaxing and being lazy. Hey that's cool, you put in your dues over the years but damn guys, the springs looked like it was deteriorating. I went through the entire place and took pictures of things that really needed to be addressed. One issue was the 45 or so gallons of bleach just piled up and laying around next to the sink and crystal pool, and some of the bottles where leaking. Leaking into the ground!. At a National Park! Near an underground water source! I busted my ass in the heat cleaning up that mess and several other messes. I'm young. Strong. In love with the springs. And motivated to not just maintain it but at this point, clean up a lot of clutter that has piled up and replace some of the infrastructure that is on its last leg. If anyone here really has an issue with that then please tell me to my face, at the springs, while we sweat shoulder to shoulder working on the place. In the mean time if you wish to send me your hate mail please send it to columbiacarriageco@yahoo.com. All of this rubbage chat is costing the forum money and they are already asking for donations. I feel like sending a letter with my donation apologizing for this post. Please no more hate, please. I'm no where near being ready to actually make this venture a reality, seems a lot of fuss for nothing.
Salt Peter

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 #20 
Lots of great discourse with the past few posts.

I want to bring up another question still relating to the OP. Elle if you had a breakdown would you know how to address it? If you were taking people out there you would be responsible for their safety. In the least I'm sure you would plan to have a PLB or other locating device. I can understand your excitement having a capable vehicle but I don't see an FJ loaded with people having enough room for all the supplies necessary for any type of emergency. Just hoping if you do go ahead with your plans that you are prepared.
oregonjohn

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 #21 
I deleted Sam's post. No need to have this info on the forum. 
 
AND the Springs are for everyone. That being said, there is an etiquette for all springs people visit. I don't want to soak in the tubs after someone has had sex in it or babies that don't wear diapers. It's just wrong in so many ways.

Elle, there is a non profit for the Springs and has been for years, it's called SPA. We have been working to keep the Springs and the valley the way it has always been. It is the volunteers that make this place work.  SPA donations keep this forum running. SPA donations help cover the cost of maintenance for the Springs. So if you really  want to help out, donate to SPA and we will put your money back into the place.

OJ
4runnerbutt

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 #22 
It IS everyone's springs and EVERYONE has the right to come here but I have to say that it is a potentially bad Idea to bring strangers out to a unforgiving, harsh and potentially deadly place.  Only for the fact that you do not know who you are dealing with.  I was out there last April and there was the usual amount of people there (I come every April and October) but there was a man who seemed destitute whom had (I heard from someone else) hitchhiked in there.  Well he was going up to everyone's campsite asking for food and water and for a ride out of there.  He was large, looked like he had been in the same clothes for a while and would sit in the pools and talk to himself.  I had serious doubts that anyone was going to be willing to give him a ride out of there without feeling that they were taking a big risk.  The guy just kept lurking and going up to peoples campsites, asking them for stuff.  So, whoever brought him out there had a reason for not wanting to take him back.  He seemed to be getting more desperate as the days went on.  I had rode a bicycle in there myself so I could be of no help.  I felt horrible for him but at the same time thought; WTF would you be doing out here without being totally prepared! YOU CAN DIE!!

Also, I think the Idea of using a place as sensitive as SVHS as a place that you can make "donations" for yourself is IMO kinda shady and inconsiderate.  Although, I would never speak for him, I highly doubt L.L. would give you his blessing.

With that said,  The idea or even putting out the idea of messing with someone's vehicle is, for lack of a better term, un-awesome.  Wether or not someone is doing something you don't agree with.
knockknock

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 #23 
Don't think you need to bring more people to s.v., just come as you are ,Enjoy quietly/ peacefully?
trigger

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 #24 
"You people" LOL! Darn you people for not wanting guided tours to the springs!! If you people don't stop this Lobo and Sparky are never gonna wanna camp with us!
MagoElle

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 #25 
I am so creeped out by that post #29
Mr.T

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 #26 
Hate getting in the middle of this, but I'm probably not the only one whose thoughts are conflicted.  On one hand I like solitude, and on the other hand it is public land.
Salt Peter

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 #27 
It is all of our hot springs. Not just people here on SPA. However, most here on SPA know a lot about how the springs operate and preserving the area. A tourist operation only gets more attention from the park service. The last thing anyone wants to see is the springs dozed. The attitude being addressed here on this thread is whether or not a paid tourism travel outfit is a good idea. The OP put forth her idea of what she had in mind and has received output from those of us who frequent this site. Think about this past winter and spring seasons where there were reports of people having sex in the pools and babies w/o swim diapers in the pools too. I sincerely doubt any of those people were frequent visitors to Saline nor care about anyone else but themselves. 
Salt Peter

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 #28 
Sparky you don't soak at the springs? There's no way I'd travel all the way out to the springs in Saline just to use the crapper.

Since you aren't a fan of camping near people would it be safe to say you aren't in favor of more people coming? Just curious.
Sparky of SoCal

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 #29 
I follow this site because of the amount of information about this part of the country. In thirty years that I have been playing in the area I have honestly only stopped at the springs to read the posted notice and female with me use the head. Not a fan of camping near people or the open area. After reading some of the post another reason not to stop is because of the attitude of the so called regular locals. Not so sure I'd want to hang with you people.
Salt Peter

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 #30 
There are plenty of other hot springs much more accessible where you could make a buck taking foreign travelers to. However having been to other springs I've often met European tourists that have somehow "found" the hotsprings. Last month up at Whitmore there was a young woman from Germany who was touring the Eastern Sierra without a tour guide.
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